Still More Things Atheists Didn’t Do
By Dave Hitt on Jun 26, 2009 in Things Atheists Didn't Do
This is another installment in our continuing series of Things Atheists Didn’t Do.
A pedophile priest, not an atheist, claimed he was only giving his victim anatomy lessons.
Muslims in Pakistan stoned a Christian man to death. His crime? Drinking tea at a roadside stall that was designated for Muslims only.
When a Christian church that tortured a gay teen via an exorcism to rid him of his faggy demon was criticized for their stupidity, Dr. Gary Cass of the Christian Anti-Defamation Commission slammed the critics, accusing them of intolerance.
An Oregon couple let their 15 month child die of pneumonia, refusing medical treatment and praying for her instead. If her parents had been atheists she would be alive right now.
An orthodox Jewish couple are suing their neighbors, claiming that an automatic hall light, which is triggered by people entering the hall, imprisons them in their apartment. This, they claim, prevents them from leaving on the Sabbath. If they were atheists instead of idiots they could leave whenever they want.
Eight people drowned a 22-year-old mother of two trying to lift a curse from her. She would have been much better off with atheist friends.
An Islamic woman starved one of her children to death, after torturing her, because she thought she was possessed. Her other five children were seriously malnourished. Too bad her mother wasn’t an atheist.
Fr. Alphonse de Valk has declared that Atheism is a threat to civilization. If he were an atheist he’d be smarter than that. Not to be outdone, Cardinal Cormac Murphy O’Connor has declared that atheists are not fully human.
Opening a dialog between religions may not be a good idea. Ernest McCullough, a Christian, got into an argument about religion with a Muslim, who ended the debate by shooting him in the leg.
In Maryland, a woman starved her son to death because he wouldn’t say Amen. She’s expecting him to be resurrected. That hasn’t happened so far. Yet another child who would have been much better off with atheist parents.
In India, at least 50 people went blind staring into the sun looking for an image of the Virgin Mary. Atheists are never blinded by the light.
When a woman with an atheist boyfriend asked Pat Robertson for advice about finding a middle ground with him, Pat told her to break up with him because he’s “serving the devil.”
In India a “Hindu Taliban” is attacking women for drinking in bars and dressing inappropriately, including those wearing bathing suits at the beach and t-shirts with pictures of their deities on them. There are no reports of atheists beating up women over religion.
In Afghanistan, a Mullah who spoke out against suicide attacks was murdered by other members of his religion of peace.
In Russia, two Jehovah’s Witnesses went on a murder spree killing 13 people to rid the world of sin. (They should have just become vampires.)
In India, two seven-year-old girls were married to frogs to prevent the disease outbreaks in the village. Atheists don’t advocate girl-frog marriage.
A pretty sixteen-year-old girl was stabbed to death by her Muslim brother for listening to rock and roll and wearing makup. He stabbed her 26 times. He was preserving the family’s honor.
Rather, the history of religion-based cruelty is long and bloody, compared to the list of atheism-based cruelty.
I feel the need to clarify (for the religion-minded, not for the poster who wrote that) that there is no such thing as ‘atheism-based cruelty.’ When an atheist does something, it’s not in the name of disbelief. The only thing atheism-based is atheism.
As opposed to people who fly planes into buildings, or blow each other up in Northern Ireland.
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
i am implying that the writer of this list is unprincipled. i would never group the whole lot of you into one moral-less whole, as the writer of this list has done to everyone who believes in a higher power. that is unprincipled.
people, since the beginning of time, have been doing horrible things to each other regardless of religion. Lenin and Stalin killed countless people in the name of communism and atheism, but does that make the concept bad? no, they were evil men. get off your high horses and realize that.
in my opinion, God is not imaginary, i just can’t prove he exists scientifically. nor are you able to prove he doesn’t exist. being derogatory towards religion just makes you look like stuck up assholes rather then supporting your opinions. being taken seriously by you isn’t much to hope for… but that’s my defence
janzie | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Heidi: Yeah, thanks for that clarification. I just wanted to tap out a fast reply on my way out the door.
@janzei:
if the whole world were atheist, maybe we’d all be as dishonest and underhanded towards each other as you have been here. no, i am not religious, i am simply honest. try it some time
No, you weren’t lumping us together at all. ::rolls my eyes::
People may have been doing horrible things to each other, but it seems that it is the religion-based conflicts which are considered socially acceptable. Up until the last 100 years or so, at least. Until now, it was the atheists who had been (and still are) demonized, while theists are pretty much free to do as they please.
The burden of proof is on the people who claim existence. You claim God exists. So prove to me God exists. I do not claim God exists (actually, I couldn’t give a rat’s as to God’s [non-]existence), so I don’t have to prove anything to you.
Deriding religion is insulting to you?
Well, as an atheist GLBT ally and a bisexual teenager, I laugh in your face. My kind have been prosecuted for hundreds of years. Yours, not so. Your kind have been in power for as long as mine have been shunned, tortured, and killed. So before saying anything about how this is insulting to you, consider us and what yours have done to ours.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@janzie You know what? I keep hearing this bit about Lenin and Stalin being atheists, as if it were a known fact. And yet a Google search tells me “maybe, probably, not sure, complex relationship with religion…” Do you have a reliable, verifiable source for this claim, or are you taking it on faith?
Regardless of their belief system, though, they did NOT do anything “in the name of” atheism. That assertion is flat out wrong. Marxism, communism, sure. But atheism doesn’t have rules other than “I don’t see any reason to believe in gods.” You really can’t do anything “in the name of” that concept. It’s nonsensical.
As for proof, can you prove Santa Claus doesn’t exist? Or Zeus? Or Thor? Do you believe that they do exist?
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
On that note: janzie, you are an atheist, too. Our atheism just extends to one more God than yours.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
well done religion, you’ve once again shown us the errors of our ways
Anonymous | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Interesting facts but terribly written. You sound like a child.
Tim | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
I can’t understand why anyone would think that this is somehow intolerant of the religulous. Come on, they did these stupid things. There is not only nothing wrong with pointing out their stupidity it needs to be pointed out.
Dave | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Tim: Let me introduce to you the argument many of my theist (ex-)friends have presented me:
Them: God exists.
Me: Where is your proof?
Them: It’s in the Bible.
Me: Okay. What makes you think the Bible is completely factual.
Them: It’s the Word of God. Of course it’s completely factual.
Me: ::points out a bunch of logical inconsistencies::
Them: It’s too bad you don’t see the light. See you in hell, sinner.
Now, you tell me that doesn’t sound childish to you, I’ll introduce you to my 4-year-old niece who constructs better arguments than that on a regular basis.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
It’s true that there are intelligent and practical people who believe in one religion or another. However religion itself never did any good to humanity. You’d think in 2,000 years that it exists, Christianity would have saved our souls already? All religions do is create pointless, yes absolutely POINTLESS conflict.
It’s like saying “My imaginary friend is real while yours is fake! DIE INFIDEL!”.
Oh, and if you’re grown up and don’t have an imaginary friend, those who do have one view you as the worst kind of person (probably they feel threatened by your logic and intelligence).
Andrew | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Andrew: I don’t think it’s religion itself that’s to blame, though. I mean, aside from the fact that it inherently encourages believers to absorb “facts” that hold no logic whatsoever, it’s innocuous enough. The trouble lies with the fundamentalists who use it as an excuse to do whatever.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
I was attending 12-step meetings and just plain got sick and tired of the “higher power” will save you crap. That all you need to stay clean and sober is to pray and put yourself into God’s hands.
Well, I went a different route and just plain made up my mind that I didn’t want to be a stoned-out freak anymore. It’s been 3.5 years and counting.
It can be done with willpower and perseverance.
No wonder the 12 step outfits have poor success over the long run. Of the 15 people I went to recovery classes with only myself and one other are still making it work for us. He doesn’t go to 12-step meetings either. LOL
Richard N | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Clearly, these people are idiots with our without religion. There are plenty of those that are quite successful at creating mayhem without God to blame. Many on your list would have done something just as stupid as they are cursed with the human condition: stupidity.
Sandy | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
If I made a list of crimes committed by atheists, would the lack of spiritual presence be to blame? I think not. There is plenty of stupid to go around.
Sandy | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
yes it would have
anonymous | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
In my home town a girl was sick and her mother was praying that she would get better. The girl was in diabetic shock and died, all she needed was a shot of insulin.
Alex | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Ahem. Fuck you and the shit you’re doing in the name of atheism. It’s as bad as the hateful indoctrination that’s done in the name of god. That’s all I have to say, and anybody who understands it isn’t going to be invested in following a line of argumentation on it, which is why I didn’t even bother reading this comment roll, I’m just so disgusted by the fact that this article even exists. I’m an atheist, and I’m /so/ above dogging on theists for stuff done by /bad people./
buzgun | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Ugh. I knew I shouldn’t have started reading, but I saw someone mention their bisexuality in defense of this bullshit. I’m also bisexual, and I care about my rights; in fact I actually fight for them, unlike so many of you barcalounger queers. Do not, -do not- use your sexuality to back up your prejudice, twat. Do what I do: direct hatred towards people for actually thinking and saying idiotic, basely offensive crap.
buzgun | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
It’s kind of annoying how us atheists act like we’re so intellectually superior to religious people, even though there are smart people in religions just like there are idiot atheists.
There will always be some insane morons in every group that will give the group itself a bad name.
Evergreen | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
To repeat myself (for no reason other than to make myself feel better, since none of you self-righteous types will read it)
NO ONE DOES ANYTHING IN THE NAME OF ATHEISM.
I dare any of you to point out a single incidence of someone who lit their child on fire, starved their child or withheld life-saving medicine because healthcare was against their non-belief. Go ahead; I’ll wait for you to try Googling for one. Oh, look. You can’t. Because IT DOESN’T HAPPEN.
The cases above cite actions that were taken specifically *because* of these people’s beliefs. They are not included here just because the perpetrators *happened* to be believers. These things were done because of their religious beliefs, and for no other reason.
I just don’t see how you people don’t get the difference.
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
I’m just so disgusted by the fact that this article even exists.
I hope you realize that most of the people disgusted that bi-sexuals like you exist get that hatred from their religon.
I’m an atheist, and I’m /so/ above dogging on theists for stuff done by /bad people./
Thanks for informing us that you’re soooo superior to us. Much appreciated.
Do what I do: direct hatred towards people for actually thinking and saying idiotic, basely offensive crap.
So you don’t dog people for doing bad things, but direct hatred towards those who think and say bad things? I think you’ve got that backwards.
Dave Hitt | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
There is this theory that religion is an evolutionary tool that helped keep together societies in the making (and law abiding, easier with the threat of eternal damnation than faulty law enforcement). But its usefulness is gone, they linger like unused tissue and limbs.
We need to speed the rate of removal of this abominations and complete our growth process.
Diego | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
“As Blufindr correctly noted, the A-Bomb was designed by a *team* of scientists.”
And several other scientists noted the possibility of creating a fission bomb.
Nate Lockwood | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
I prefer ‘THERE IS NO GOD. GET OVER IT!’
Phil E. Drifter | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Richard N | Jun 29, 2009
“Clearly, these people are idiots with ***our*** without religion.”
psst buddy you forgot to spellcheck
Phil E. Drifter | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Um, I’m an atheist, but of all you who are saying these aren’t the cases of extremists, are dipshits. Of course they are fucking extremists! They are killing/torturing/hurting people because of religion, and that sounds pretty extremist to me. You don’t see the average Christian or Jew going down the street with a AK47 shooting it at anybody who doesn’t believe what they say.
Cara | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Excellent post dude!
hey – checkout: http://www.thinkersplayground.com/public/articles/10-dude-where-s-my-soul
Gavin | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
These people would have done this (or something like this) regardless of religion. Religion doesn’t make people crazy. Could these religions have created the target for their crazy hate, perhaps. Like those rapists and murderers who “find god” in prison, they are not any different before or after.
Common Sense | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
A huge reply today. Sorry, guys. Just do a quicksearch for your name. If you’ve posted recently, I’ve probably replied to you.
@Richard N: I suffer from bouts of depression and mania (similar to those experienced by those with manic-depressive disorders). A Christian friend of mine, who knows I am for the most part anti-religion, spent the better part of an evening trying to lecture me about how “[his] God was everyone’s God […] and he saves.”
I acknowledge that for some people, the idea that God may be backing them up is useful in giving them the motivation they need to get their lives back together. But in that case, why not cut out the middle-man? Why not take full responsibility for their own actions, acknowledge that it was their work and their work alone that got them out of their rut, even if God “inspired” them to do so?
@Sandy: The point is not that these people are stupid. The point, as Heidi pointed out, is that these people acted as their religion told them to act. No atheist shall ever commit such crimes based on their belief (or apparent lack thereof).
In addition, any atheist who commits a crime is fully responsible for his or her actions. We, unlike our theist counterparts, do not have a socially-acceptable psychosis.
@buzgun: I was unaware that Dave had posted this “in the name of atheism”. If you have evidence to the contrary, please, share with the group.
I am not using my sexuality in defence of my ragging on theists. I am using it to point out that the playing field has been leveled, for once. You tell me a period in history where atheists have enjoyed the same power and privileges as theists have done. Here’s a pro-tip for you: It doesn’t exist. Up until recently, to be socially reputable, one had to be a theist. To freely admit otherwise was to be branded a sinner, a heathen, and various other adjectives I shall keep out of this post for the sake of politeness.
I was unaware that I was not fighting for my rights. In fact, I was completely unaware that lobbying for a GLBT community support group, appealing to schools to allow students to take same-sex partners to functions, and participating in every march in my region meant I was being a “barcalounger queer”.
As for “direct[ing my] hatred towards people for actually thinking and saying idiotic, basely offensive crap.” Did you actually read Dave’s article? Or did you just see the title and begin a debate with little information? I am most certainly not going to allow ignorant, fundamentalist torturers and murders to get away with such behaviour. If I performed these same actions, I would be branded a loony. Why not so for these people? Oh, wait, that’s right. Religion is a socially- and historically-cultivated norm. This makes it that little bit easier for these people to do whatever they like, and be guaranteed support from people within their religion. Simply directing my anger towards the idiots who are all talk, is not going to save any children against being vicariously murdered.
@Evergreen: Your point is absolutely valid. However, the issue is not the inherent idiocy of people in either camp. Here, at least, the issue is that theism allows much more extreme behaviour, in a setting which makes it at least somewhat morally acceptable by others of the same religion.
@Dave: A great many Christians (I take Christians as an example, since I don’t know much of Islam or other major religions and I’d rather not make myself look like any more of a “twat”) are unaware that they are forbidden, by religion, from: consuming shellfish, wearing gold, wearing pearls, allowing women to speak up, consuming blood (the blood in meat is not exempt), working on the Sabbath, consuming pork (or even touching a dead pig), wearing clothing of mixed cloth, or cross-planting (among other things).
These same Christians are also usually unaware that premarital sex, worshipping idols (an aside: Is a statue of the Virgin Mary now no longer considered an idol?), blasphemy, trying to convert people to another religion (!!) striking/cursing your parents, murder, and perjury are punishable by death in the Old Testament.
(Interestingly, so is incest. And yet, it is considered acceptable, at least at the very start. Glenn Miller has written an article addressing this, which can be found here.)
However, the aforementioned Christians can, with confidence, spout off quotation after quotation from the Bible that frowns upon homosexuality. This leads me to believe that again, religion serves as an acceptable scapegoat for deep-seated homophobia.
@Diego: I disagree. I’ve been a long-term believer that religion is nothing more than an adult’s bed-time story, and its primary role is to try to inject some semblance of meaning into our lives. So really, from the start, it’s had very little use for anything else.
I do agree that we should be encouraging its “removal”.
**Quickly, before someone (else) rags on me for bagging their belief in a preternatural faerie.**
Disclaimer: There is a profound difference between “religious” and “spiritual”. I take no issue with someone believing in a higher power, or being close to the earth or anything like that (unless they’re like those vegan parents who killed their baby, trying to keep her on a vegan diet). It is organised religion, with set rules of “my imaginary friend told me this, and thus it must be true”, and extremists of such catechisms, that I feel the most antagonistic about.
@Phil E. Drifter: Spell-check wouldn’t have caught that. No spell-check is good enough to catch misuse of words — yet.
@Common Sense: [::chuckles:: Sorry. The address line in this strikes me as profoundly funny]
I don’t believe this is necessarily the case. Religion fuels the hatred, and makes it quasi-acceptable for people to do this without needing to atone for their actions. Furthermore, if your hypothesis held true, there’d be a great number more atheists running around doing these same things. ::looks around:: I don’t see any. Do you?
I’m thinking it’s more the case that religion makes it at least semi-possible for them to act out, and be misogynistic, lupine, abusive, fallacious, homophobic, and otherwise generally neurotic, without being much affected by the social purgatory which is inflicted upon those who perform the same acts without religious excuses.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
I’m thinking it’s more the case that religion makes it at least semi-possible for them to act out, and be misogynistic, lupine, abusive, fallacious, homophobic, and otherwise generally neurotic, without being much affected by the social purgatory which is inflicted upon those who perform the same acts without religious excuses.
This is exactly it. When Daniel Hauser’s mother ran away with him after the judge ordered chemo, fundies I know were horrified that a judge could force them to not let their son die. Think about that. I got a Tweet about it that said it was an infringement on family rights, and that it was up to the mother whether their child should have treatment. (i.e. it’s ok to let this little boy die, because his mothers’ religion says he can be cured with some herbs and some woo.) But oh, look. He’s back, getting chemo, and the tumor is shrinking, even though it was not responding at all to the woo.
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Oh, but my point there was that religious doctrine basically gives you a get out of jail free card. Fortunately that’s changing now.
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
THINGS ATHEISTS DIDN’T (DON’T) DO:
Blow up the World Trade Center.
Kill millions of people for an imaginary friend.
Brainwash people all over the world to believe in a religion for economical reasons.
Blindly follow the words of sheep herders thousands of years ago.
Rambo | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
No offense, but this made absolutely no sense. Your grammar is horrid and your points aren’t logical.
Are you 13?
Female | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@blufindr: Wow. Get a life. I bet you’re overweight.
Female | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
This is groundlessly inflammatory, and you should all be ashamed of wasting time and energy here.
What You Guys Didn’t Do:
Read a book.
Help those who need.
Pick up trash around your neighborhood.
Further your education.
There’s a myriad of things you should be doing instead of making sweeping generalizations and ad hominem statements. Give some a spin, you just might enjoy it.
Taylor | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Female: I bet you’re fatter, cutie ;D
Kenny | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Female: Actually, I’m underweight. And I’m this way because I’ve been basically starving myself for 6 months, from stress and dysmorphia. My boyfriend only just managed to convince me that I’m fine, with a BMI of just over 20.
But thanks. Good to know you can make such baseless and cruel comments. I’m going to continue starving myself, thanks. And you can be the one to explain to him when I end up in hospital for malnutrition. Hell, I mean, I’m already experiencing hypotension from that. But whatever. That’s irrelevant, as long as I’m overweight, right?
@Taylor: And your comment is not at all “groundlessly inflammatory”. I read on a regular basis, volunteer at various charities, participate in Clean Up Australia days, plant trees, cut down my personal carbon emissions and persuade others to do the same.
Dave did not make any “sweeping generalizations”, besides from commenting that these actions (all performed by theists), are not actions that atheists are known to do.
There’s a myriad of things you can do, instead of accusing us of being ignorant and unprincipled. Bust open a history book sometime, and note just how many events of wanton cruelty have been caused by atheists. Oh wait. There are none.
I’m not saying that atheists do not commit atrocious crimes. I’m saying that theists typically have a “get out of jail free card”, as Heidi previously put it, simply because they are deluded enough to believe in an all-powerful imaginary friend.
So, you know. “Smartenize” yourself, or stay the hell out of these debates.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
What You Guys Didn’t Do:
Read a book.
Actually, I just finished Sam Harris’s The End of Faith, Christopher Hitchens’s god is not Great, and I’m halfway through Origin of Species. Oh, and earlier this month I read a book about TMJ treatment, and another about the treatment of musculoskeletal pain. (This was all during June.) And you?
@blufinder: You’re fine. Listen to your BF. He is right. 20 BMI is great! You don’t want to go much below that, or you’ll start *really* feeling the health issues. Seriously. Try to look at photos of other people with your BMI. They’re fine, too. Don’t listen to some hag who doesn’t know you, and who is too much of a coward to even make up a fake name for posting. “Female.” Very creative. *pfft*
And check it out:
“For adults, an ideal BMI is between 18.5 and 24.9. A person with a BMI over 24.9 is considered overweight, and a person with a BMI under 18.5 is considered underweight.”
http://bmi.emedtv.com/bmi/ideal-bmi.html
You’re not only fine, you’re just about perfect! Go ahead and ask your BF if you don’t believe me. ;-)
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Heidi: Hah! I’m quite sure Brian will agree with you whole-heartedly. And probably berate the life out of that poster, while he’s at it. He’s good like that. ;)
Thank you. I’ve been having a hell of a day, and this just kinda was the straw that broke the camel’s back, you know?
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
Welcome. :-) Hang in there and don’t beat yourself up, ok?
Heidi | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
@Heidi: Shall try. Brian would probably go nuts if I did anything less, anyway. He’s a keeper, this one. Hah.
blufindr | Jun 29, 2009 | Reply
OK, I was brought up in a Christian house. Officially, I’m a Muslim. In reality, an Athiest. Had to “convert/revert” to marry my lovely wife. So yes, I’m a hypocrit. But so are the people that said that it was the only way I could be with her & don’t mind that I still eat pork, drink beer & have never seen the inside of a Mosque.
Religions are passing myths.
Roman & Greek MYTHOLOGY, as we call it now, were once religions. Christianity is based on numerous former religions (paganism etc). December 25th – pagan. Easter – pagan. The saviour rising from the dead after 3 days – pagan. The list could go on.
Even if religious people evolved & develop the ability to think for themselves, Christianity, Islam etc may all fall. But they’ll be replaced by new BS.
Stuffed | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
Or religion may be the result of mental insecurity.
“Religion is a crutch for those who don’t have drugs” – a friend of mine wore that T-shirt…. to church (forced to go by overbearing parents)
Stuffed | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
Blufindr: I agree that for most theists using their ‘religion’ as a crutch for drug/alcohol recovery does work- for a while. What generally seems to happen when one interviews a theist after a relapse is that they will pull something out of the ‘excuse’ bag- such as- “it’s OK because I’m forgiven”… or something to that effect. It seems difficult for them to have long term success because they always have an “out”. “I’m weak and the devil got to me” is another favorite.
If one is to take recovery seriously (for life) you need to put yourself into your own hands, not some invisible friend- who always has an “escape clause”.
Say Howdy Blu, I am also a recovering mental health case- severe depression and schizo. And of course drug abuse (self medicating- LOL). I happily take an antidepressant that has worked for me for 3.5 years. It’s not been easy, but very worthwhile…Rick
Richard N | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
@Stuffed: Be that as it may be, one cannot deny that unspeakable horrors have been committed in the name of religion. I wasn’t going to bring ancient religions into it, but now that you’ve brought up that point, I feel it necessary to point out that atheists have never sacrificed any living being (animal or no) to appease our imaginary friend.
Your statement about religion being a “crutch” is another one that is all too true. The point is not that religious people commit atrocious deeds.1 The point is that these acts are performed in the name of religion, in a manner which makes them at least somewhat acceptable.
In an atheist society, one who kills a woman to “defend family honour” would be punished fittingly. In our theist society, such a one may be lauded, maybe even beatified. This is where the uneven power play between religion and lack thereof comes in to things. We are on an uneven footing, because we do not have the same freedom as our deluded comrades, to do whatever and pin the blame on our systems of belief.
1: This is not a sweeping statement about all theists. This is in support of the above article, that horrible things are done and some of them are committed by theists.
@Richard N: Hah, oh, how I agree with you. I was briefly institutionalised last year in a Christian mental facility. If I hear “God will save you if you only let him help” one more time, I think I’ll scream. If I am to get better, it will be through my own will. Not that of a preternatural faerie, who I’m sure has better matters to attend to anyway.
Because of my current home situation, I am unable to be prescribed any anti-depressants. However, I, too, self-medicate. I am perfectly aware that I am a flawed, bitter being. I don’t see how further deluding myself with belief in an incorporeal, invisible, and yet omnipotent being. The responsibility for recovery rests primarily on me.
blufindr | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
Good morning,
I’ve been reading the collective conciousness of the preceding posts for a little while now and trying to find the most appropriate way to put this.
Apparently one thing atheism did quite well was give alot of people of very heady sense of smug self satisfaction that they have finally broken free of the addled masses of the faithful. They are the true enlightened ones in that they have left their beliefs in god(s) and organized religion behind them and moved forward in rationality and obstinacy.
The faithful all the while mired in their ignorance and inscience. Unable to comprehend the truth of it in that belief in a flying spaghetti monster is no more sane or appropriate than believing Elvis is still alive and doing 3 shows a week in Vegas.
In all honesty i’ve noticed one thing very prevalent in many many of these comments. Those who made them know who they are, and those who’ve read them know what I mean. Belief or otherwise flaming someone for whatever reason at its basic level is not conducive to constructive conversation so in doing so you’re merely doing your very best Nancy Grace impersonation. The last thing she got to the bottle of was a bottle of #8 peroxide bleach, am i right? No I jest, she is needlessly inflamatory but in truth that gets the job done for her. It gets her ratings. It keeps her paid. And it really solves nothing when you get right down to it so lets all just put the sticks down and have a constructive conversation.
All of the examples given in the list are valid don’t get me wrong they made be simple ad hoc examples of things believe have done using religion as a reason or an excuse but the comments attached to them are no less inflamatory than many made here. Are no more conducive to a proper education of our young then telling them its all right to pick on the one kid in class who wears a cross because he’s obviously in need of a good beating.
Religion doesn’t just give people an excuse to do things it also gives those in full control of their mental and physical faculties hope, comfort, joy, religion is many things to many people. To more people than not religion brings a positivity that these people cannot find elsewhere.
Being an atheist, lacking belief or spirituatlity. (Yes i realize atheism is dictionarily defined as lack of belief in “(G)god(s)”) In this meager authors humble opinion is the same as using your religion as an excuse for murder, genocide, rape, mistrust of preventative/curative medicines, etc. is fruitless and ill-advised at the very very least.
Lack of faith or lack of spirituality and railing against such spirituality in the name of the flesh and in the name of the tangible is again in my opinion tantamount to forsaking the quest for knowledge and self-discovery.
Someone said the burden of proof is on the religious to prove god doesn’t exist. Proving something doesn’t exist is hard or impossible. Proving that someones beliefs are valid is no more easy than proving that they don’t.
If someone talks to god because they believe he can hear them is no more/less comforting than talking to their plants or to their pets. Sure the plants are phyically there, and their pet might just be in their lap making the conversation less outwardly awkward but it is no more or less comforting to the individual. And is that any more or less than just simply positive.
Nobody has the technology, the time, or the funding to look under every and any rock in the universe. Proof of concept for faith may be out their be we just can’t find it. The burden of proof is on both groups my friends, and i propose a race. Whoever finds what they believe in first wins a double-dose of smug self satisfaction and the right to say “nya nya, i was right” for eternity.
I’m going to rap it up here. As i’ve droned on long enough.
Am i religious. Not exactly. I was raised catholic but i do not believe in an all powerful being in control of my life. Thats just what i believe. Why i believe that i honestly don’t know.
The bible, the Qur’an, the Talmud, the Torah, the Epic of Gilgamish, the Pantheon.
The are each allegorical to one another and in fact may all be the same religion in the end.
The truest, nay the ONLY true and honest statement in any of those great works is this. When their respective gods were asks to prove themselves, they replied merely by stating that “I am”.
“I am”, “you are”, we all are simply that. We simply are. No more or less than god or a fantastic friend that some people may and or many not have (un)necessarily deified. We all just are we will continue to be for a long long time.
Don’t “pick a religion” it’s not a colour wheel. Choose your faith like you’d choose a wife/husband/life partner. It is a special and personal choice, its a journey that everyone will take one day. You’ve all taken the first steps to understand yourselves and turned away from captiol G organized religion. But don’t turn your back on the organism that stands before you in the mirror. You are. You have flesh and blood and knowledge and ablility and you also have a spirit. Not a holy-wear-a-halo-and sing hymns spirit but a honest wholesome part of yourself that makes you quintesentially you. It goes beyond the real and the tangible. Its what connects you to the universe. Don’t give up your quest for understanding simply because you think the faithful are insane. Just understand yourself better to know what to put your faith in.
God does exist my friends. Go check the bathroom… right above the sink. I’ll wait. :)
Solifluction | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
I promise next time i’ll run a spell check. :)
Solifluction | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
You know, I was originally going to respond to “Solifluction” with a point-by-point reply and quotes. But I’ve changed my mind. I’m going to sum it up, instead.
1. I can’t even believe you compared atheism to violent crime. Raise your hand if you’ve committed genocide. Oh, look! No one here!
2. I find it pretty amusing that you’re bitching about a “very heady sense of smug self satisfaction” in a condescending, and offensive I-know-better-than-you-do-my-children post. Ah, the irony.
3. What on earth makes you think that we are all on our “first steps?” I’ve been an atheist for 20 years. Thought about it already, argued about it with my parents long ago, and I’m very clear in what I believe. And I don’t believe in the supernatural. I have never seen anything that would remotely suggest to me that I should. I’m not going to revise my position without some evidence. And I’m no more likely to waste my time looking for evidence of gods than I am to go looking for evidence of Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny.
Heidi | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
haha my brother, Catholic, just condemned me as a demon for even being on this site. he said that it is a biased representation of religious sects and that I should read the bible
Dan | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply
So my little site can cause readers to become demonized? Cool! Ah, the power, the power…
Dave Hitt | Jun 30, 2009 | Reply